fleming yachts vs nordhavn

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Are Nordhavn Yachts Any Good?

I recently watched a YouTube video from Ta Shing Yacht Building, one of the larger builders of the Nordhavn line of offshore trawler yachts. The video was all about splashing the 600th Nordhavn, N68 #42.

Imagine that: 600 Nordhavn Yachts launched since the first Nordhavn 46 came on the scene in 1989. While the new 46-foot trawler yacht from PAE was not initially accepted in the mainstream cruising world, it would be the tip of the spear of the developing offshore passagemaking industry.

And the Nordhavn Yacht delivered on all fronts, proving its reputation as a good,quality boat.

Yes, it was small for its overall length, not as roomy as expected in a motor vessel over 45 feet in length. But it had something that other boats did not have. In addition to a super reliable single engine installation and systems, it had sufficient tankage and range to cross oceans.

The Nordhavn 46 had an appeal to sailors who could see its value despite lacking a mast, sails, and rig. It was new, it was interesting, and it was cool.

Jim and Suzy Sink circumnavigated on Salvation II, proving that a world cruise on a motorboat was not simply a fluke associated with that madman Robert Beebe. It was rather a validation of his genius so wonderfully defined in the visionary Voyaging Under Power.

Wolfgang and Heidi Hass made several circumnavigations on their N46, Kanaloa, and proved more was possible with less. A minimalist German couple, I remember their reason for not having an attached swim platform on the stern of their boat. When visiting remote island groups, especially back in those early days, their very presence in an anchorage filled the locals with excitement and wonder.

When someone then paddled out to Kanaloa, they felt it a liability to have a swim platform, as it was easy to lose control of the situation. With a swim platform, it was only natural for these locals, whose purpose was not yet clear, to climb onto the swim platform. They are now on your boat.

This was certainly something to consider back at a time when such remote contacts were the exception, not a commonplace situation like it is today.

Much later, Scott and Mary Flanders took their N46 around the world via a difficult and unusual way, earning them the Royal Cruising Club Trophy from the Cruising Club of America .

While the cruising world gradually accepted the N46, the company also designed and built the Nordhavn 62, an all-business passagemaker that looked every bit as competent as any commercial or research vessel. In fact, I recall the coincidence of seeing an image of a Nordhavn 62 on the same right-hand page in PassageMaker Magazine as a quarter-page ad for active fin stabilizers that included a picture of a Romsdal-style commercial boat that could have easily been a sistership.

PAE, the marketing and design company behind the Nordhavn brand, continued to expand the brand with the introduction of new models each year. Unlike some classic yachts, such as the Fleming 55, in which the boat is continually refined from year to year, or more accurately in the case of the Fleming, continually refined from one hull to the next, PAE takes a different approach. When there are more than a few changes needed to incorporate into a particular model, very often other ideas have developed, and the company works on a new model that incorporates things that could be improved as well as new design ideas. It has been a winning formula.

I spoke to my friend Jeff Merrill, who joined the Nordhavn team after experience at Pacific Seacraft in the creation of the Nordhavn 40. Jeff was a sales broker and project manager with PAE for 14 years. In addition to the satisfying experience of building boats for an average couple to enjoy an above average adventure, Jeff was part of the exponential growth of the company.

Jeff told me he enjoyed helping couples realize that regular people could cross oceans if they really wanted, given the right boat, the necessary training, and putting the other major factors in place, such as weather planning and routing.

He knew the Nordhavn product line appealed to people who had visions of visiting faraway places in comfort and safety.

“The people behind Nordhavn built boats they wanted to build, not to a price point in the industry. We focused on safety, economy of operation, and ease of maintenance. The boats would have keel coolers and dry stacks, just like commercial fishing boats, and continuously rated diesel engines, in robust propulsion packages.

“Yes, every 5-10 boats would have improved features from previous boats, but better designs would then surface to replace the earlier models.”

Many of the new boats used the same hull molds but with a new deck. The N47 became the N52, the N55 became the N60 and N63, and so on. Most models benefited from extra length, which often translated into a larger, extended cockpit for more living space and a more balanced overall profile. Once inside the saloon door, however, it was the same volume boat inside, and similar interior unless the new deck mold changed the layout.

Which somewhat explains the list of models introduced since the N46. There have been the N35, N40, N41, N43, N46, N47, N475, N50, N51, N52, N55, N56, N57, N59, N60, N62, N625, N63, N64, N68, N71, N72, N75, N76, N80, N86, N96, N120, and the N148.

It is important to note that despite the number of models, the similarity of systems and system designs means each is robustly engineered, well proven, and assures the safety and reliability that is key to all Nordhavns.

Today’s fleet is refined, very capable, and instantly recognizable. Most every boater can pick out a Nordhavn in any marina around the world. Each is the image of a rugged, capable, offshore passagemaker.

(Below: The Nordhavn 52 has been in the model range for quite some time.)

As I write this, a well-known delivery captain is delivering a N76 from Australia to Anacortes, via Fiji and Hawaii. The comments in his Facebook post are a testament to the boat, with comments such as, “Well, that is the boat for this trip,” or “What a great adventure this will be.” It seems the reputation of the Nordhavn brand almost assures a safe passage.

Yet, to be clear, a Nordhavn is not the perfect boat for everyone, which makes for a challenge for an experienced broker to help educate and defuse the statement I have heard hundreds of times over the years. “If I had that boat, I could go to Tahiti.” Even though his goal is coastal cruising with the family.

The reality is that the full displacement Nordhavns are slow, by many standards, as are all yachts operating as full displacement boats. Many of these large, heavy trawler yachts have a single Deere diesel engine that is continuous duty rated at 325hp. Slow steady cruising speeds get one to paradise, but it may not be the right choice for a couple whose destinations are closer to home and where higher speeds are a better fit.

Then there is the issue of how the boat will be used once it arrives. For a cruising plan that includes crossing an ocean to get to the islands or to cruise European canals, this also may not be the right choice. Having several thousand gallons of fuel and water aboard won’t be necessary, nor will the deeper draft and air height of a full displacement passagemaker make it possible to travel the canals in France.

For the Great Loop in North America, there are many better choices, without height and draft restrictions. And long-term self-sufficiency is simply not needed.

(Below: The Nordhavn 59 named INDEPENDENCE, owned by a California couple, cruising the Great Loop.)

For those thinking of world cruising, it is important to accept that the world is not what it was, even a decade or two ago. There are now issues that make circling the world less desirable.

Jimmy Cornell has been following and publishing data and trends about world cruising for over 40 years. He is the founder of the World Cruising Club, after successfully launching the first ARC (Atlantic Rally for Cruisers) in 1986. His World Cruising Club has since hosted many other rallies and events around the globe to inspire and assist cruisers looking to travel over the horizon.

He gave a fascinating virtual slideshow and lecture about modern day cruising just as Covid shut our doors to the outside world. His information, gathered from many years of hosting cruising events, is an accurate snapshot of cruising, using the important focal points of the Canary Islands, Bermuda, Panama, the Galapagos, Tahiti, Tonga, and Australia.

According to Cornell, there are several distinct reasons why world cruising likely peaked in 2010 and has steadily decreased in the number of yachts ever since. And the major reasons for this decline all relate to safety concerns. Climate change has very much impacted traditional cruising routes. Areas where there was a clearly defined window for safe passage, such as the NW Pacific, now have typhoons occur every month. There is no longer a “safe” season.

(Below: Jimmy Cornell on a cruise.)

Tropical storm seasons in general are less clearly defined but more active than before. The frequency and severity of tropical storms is increasing. The traditional hurricane season as defined for North America is no longer well defined between June 1st and November. Storms now happen outside that window.

Long-term planning is even more important given these erratic variables.

In addition, personal safety is also a very real issue in high-risk areas where there is piracy and crime. These areas are now expanding beyond the Red Sea, and now include Venezuela (especially between Trinidad and Grenada), Brazil, Honduras, West Africa, and parts of the Caribbean.

But none of the above issues are as limiting as they might seem, as many Nordhavn owners are more interested in extended cruising in specific areas, such as the tropics or the far north, and living aboard. Spending months in the Caribbean or the Mediterranean means the owners won’t need daily trips ashore for provisions, water, and fuel for the generator. All Nordhavns are quite capable of providing long periods of self sufficiency just fine.

About introducing a new boat to its owners, one issue I know all too well is how many people find any boat with a lot of systems quite intimidating. And it is impractical and unrealistic to get a new owner up to speed by spending a day or two with him or her about the systems and how they work. I have seen too many examples where that goes awry. I remember the new owner of an Independence Cherubini 45 was headed to his home port of Put-in-Bay in Ohio from Delran, New Jersey on his new boat. Unfortunately, he somehow messed up his fuel manifold valving, and somehow the diesel in his return fuel line went overboard.

He suddenly found himself out of fuel off the New Jersey coast just north of Atlantic City. I never did find out how his manifold allowed that to happen.

The key to getting a new boat dialed in, according to Jeff, is to take small steps, one at a time. Spend days at the dock, checking things in as methodical a way as possible. Wake up in the middle of the night and check the pilothouse instruments and overall lighting. Take day trips close to home. Baby steps.

“You have to sneak up on it,” he said about the process of becoming familiar with the new boat. Go out on your first overnight, then your first nighttime passage. It will be the same as during the day but at night it will feel very different.

“Know what tools to have aboard,” he added.

The valuable point here is that when the project manager hands the Nordhavn over to you, you can be assured it is a capable boat without lots of nagging issues. So, the new owner can focus on regular maintenance, what it is, where it is, and what is involved…not managing oil leaks or strange warning codes from a black box. Your Nordhavn has been well figured out, which allows the new owner the focus on what he or she must learn to keep the boat running.

The smartest (and most experienced) owners I know did not load up their new boat and head over the horizon. Rather, they stayed near services, and if they took delivery of the boat near the Pacific Northwest, for example, they spend a full summer season cruising the pristine Northwest, perhaps eventually up to Alaska. This contrasts to owners who take off immediately and then have issues that are difficult to address in some out-of-the-way tropical paradise where even getting parts is an unpleasant adventure.

Jeff says the absolute best resource for new owners is the Nordhavn Owners Group, a closed group of owners who freely share information. For the new Nordhavn owner, it is an essential connection. Industry experts regularly comment and offer suggestions. Any question you might ask has very likely been asked and addressed before.

(Below: A Nordhavn owner rendezvous in progress.)

“You have a good boat, with good documentation. Now it is time to connect with the NOG to pull it all together,” he said.

Looking at the distribution of new boat builds over the years, the sweet spot in the lineup is the N55, N60, and N63, based on the number of builds for those models. The three models share the same hull and offer similar accommodations. They can be built with single or twin engines, and they have evolved with wide side decks on the starboard side, which experience has shown offers the maximum in accommodations and working deck layout.

For many enthusiasts of the trawler community, and whose ideas of bucket list cruises includes distant shores and islands associated with either lavish tropical paradise or remote minimalist adventures, the Nordhavn continues to be one of the top choices.

While many might argue that the standard 24VDC bow thruster is not as good as a larger hydraulic unit that can run continuously, or that the standard single generator is not as good as duplicate, 20kW units or a smaller second unit for lighter and nighttime duty, this is the stuff of dock debate. And of course, buyers can opt for duplicate generators and other systems well beyond the standard spec sheet.

Many folks like to argue about the finer points that constitute the perfect passagemaker. But as history has shown, the number of Nordhavns and their owners, enjoying life around the globe, prove that at some point, it is just time to go.

As a wise person once said, perfection is the enemy of good enough. And in all aspects of the Nordhavn experience, things are well beyond simply good enough.

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Sum of Its Parts: Fleming 55

• By George Sass Sr.
• Updated: September 9, 2011

In my lifetime, a small handful of production boats have become true classics, if not legends. The Bertram 31, Grand Banks 42, Hinckley Bermuda 40 and Hatteras 53 come to mind and are examples of designs that enjoyed lengthy, successful production runs. Long after they were discontinued, they have remained popular on the brokerage market, sometimes commanding premium prices.

Among these recent classics, one model remains in production today. Hull No. 212 of the Fleming 55 was delivered in April 2011, and a number of new 55s are in production at Fleming ‘s yard in Taiwan ( see the gallery with detail photos here ). First launched in 1985, the Fleming 55 owes its longevity not only to its successful design, but also to the company’s commitment to making improvements to each hull it builds.

Duncan Cowie and Adi Shard, the talented Brits who have taken over the management of the company from its founder, Tony Fleming, say each new Fleming 55 incorporates eight to 10 improvements over the previous hull. Based on building an average of 10 55s per year, the math equates to 400 to 500 changes over just a five-year period.

Keeping this classic up to date is largely the result of the relationship among the factory, Fleming’s dealers and its owners. Chuck Hovey Yachts on the West Coast and Burr Yacht Sales on the East Coast have been Fleming’s only dealers in the United States since the brand’s earliest days. Along with Fleming’s select dealers in Canada and Europe, they have a valuable, historical understanding of the product. “I can’t remember how many times a customer has asked ‘What if we did this?’” comments Ray Currey of Burr Yacht Sales. “Some of these suggestions make very good sense, and we pass them along to the factory to be considered for future production.”

While Fleming embraces new ideas and technology, the company is quick to point out that it makes changes only after thorough research and sea trials, as opposed to catering to whims and fancies. For example, the 55’s centerline hallway leading to three staterooms and two heads all on one level is a hallmark of Fleming’s design. This arrangement eliminates steep, hard-to-negotiate stairways needed to accommodate a midships master stateroom — a feature that may seem attractive but which creates unintended design consequences. Also sacred to Fleming’s design is its dedicated pilothouse, which is three steps up from the ship’s living area. Because one does not pass through the pilothouse to the staterooms or heads below, the ship’s operation is undisturbed while guests freely enjoy the yacht’s living and sleeping areas.

Likewise, the Fleming’s semidisplacement hull design, with its sharp entry, rounded bilge sections forward, hard chines aft and moderate deadrise, has proven itself to be comfortable, seaworthy and efficient throughout its cruising-speed range of 8 to 18 knots. With so many Fleming 55s safely cruising throughout the world, the company knows it has a winner and has not changed its basic hull design Likewise, most of Fleming’s owners use their yachts the way Tony Fleming originally intended — for coastal and offshore cruising. The company keeps an open line of communication with its owners, who are only too happy to share their personal tips and tricks, the best of which have been incorporated into production. And last but not least, Tony Fleming continues to cruise the world’s oceans on his personal Fleming, vigorously testing new ideas and equipment. ( See more of these adventures here .)

The complexity of today’s Fleming 55 is a far cry from when Tony Fleming launched his first hull. To ensure that its boats comply with all current safety and construction standards, as well as federal regulations, Fleming has taken a major step forward in having its new boats certified by the National Marine Manufacturers Association (NMMA).

The NMMA certification process was no casual undertaking; it required rigorous inspections of the company’s facility in Taiwan as well as finished boats located in Maryland and Vancouver, British Columbia. In addition, all Fleming models will now be inspected on an annual basis. NMMA-certified boats must also meet the stringent standards of ABYC (American Boat & Yacht Council), as well as comply with Environmental Protection Agency requirements for emissions and wastewater systems.

While all boats sold in the United States must meet U.S. Coast Guard minimum regulations, NMMA-certified boats, like the Fleming 55, benefit from this vigorous, third-party inspection program. Tony Fleming must have known from the beginning that he had a winner in his Fleming 55. But only through a consistent program of upgrading, improving and refining the original has it reached its current status of a thoroughly modern living legend.

Fleming Yachts, 949-645-1024; www.flemingyachts.com

_ Read more about Fleming’s yachts._

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The old debates…

Online forums, blogs, and nautical magazines are filled with stories and comments aimed at igniting World War 3… Single screw vs twin engine, displacement vs semi-displacement, wide body vs semi-wide body, hydraulic fins or paravanes, steel or fiberglass, et cetera… The discussions are as endless as they are passionate! Sometimes, they’re even being conducted by people who have never even owned a boat! In contrast, boat-owners actually tend to spend very little time partaking in such debates because they’re too busy sailing with the boat they have…

What is the best ocean capable boat?

Our revamped Selene website has been online for over a year now, and has become incredibly popular with several hundreds of views per day from around the globe, not counting the many inquiries we receive daily about several models of the Selene line. It is usually during those inquiries that the question of Selene vs Nordhavn is raised…

It is not uncommon for a potential client asking in a very simple, and sometimes naive manner, which brand of passage-maker is the best. Most of the time such discussions are brought on the table, it becomes evident that our clients have already shortlisted the two famous brands; Selene, and Nordhavn, which frequently leads us to an odd and awkward question, “be honest, which brand makes the best boats?”

The other best brand

Our answer always remains the same. Nordhavn, is the other best brand. That’s it. We are not competing with the talented Dana Point boat builders, and we doubt they’re trying to compete with us. The gentlemen who founded Nordhavn are regarded with the utmost respect at Selene, and we can only hope the sentiment is mutual. It turns out, there is more than enough room in the yacht market for two quality boat builders, each with their own qualities and talents.

When it comes to dedication and skill for quality, performance, safety, and beauty, both companies are unmatched in the zeal and talent of our marine architects, engineers and workers. Simply seeing the boats of either brand suffices to drive the point home; they are beautiful, and have perfect records, each with their own personality. So, what is the best? A Rolls Royce or a Bentley? When potential buyers insist on knowing which brand makes the best boats, we happily tell them, “go and see our colleagues at Nordhavn and make up your mind. Here or there, you will not be disappointed either way.” Both our vessels are capable of crossing oceans in style, safety, and of course, comfort…

An ocean-capable boat is a dream machine, and I doubt any boat builder in our league would dare risk blowing a dream… One important thing to keep in mind is: don’t hesitate for too long! After all, the heart knows what it wants, and instead of spending countless sleepless nights browsing the internet and making tedious comparisons between boats and brands whilst looking for the perfect vessel, remember there is no such thing as a universally perfect boat. Owning a boat, is above all, a love story, and when it comes to yachts, it’s often love at first sight! You didn’t compare your wife or husband to other potentials before tying the knot, did you?

Listen to you heart…

Both our companies have spent fortunes in R&D, training, tank testing, sea trials and sourcing of new technologies. We know our business, and in conclusion, never buy a boat based on other people’s comments or from lengthy online debates regarding the superiority of one brand or the other. It’s not the armchair sailors you want to listen to when it comes to issues of space and accessibility in the engine room, windage in ports, or behaviour in a following sea, but your heart, and your gut. Find a boat you can afford and handle comfortably, raise the anchor, and unfurl your sails… or rather, switch on the engine.

Last but not least, I’m a long-time mariner who cut his teeth in the Mediterranean Sea and the Indian Ocean with a few tens of thousands of miles under my belt. I’ve owned both a beautiful Nordhavn and still own a beautiful Selene, and you will never hear me making silly and useless comparisons between two of the finest boat building brands out there. I’d rather go sailing…

Selene Yachts Vice President

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Secondhand boat buyers’ guide: 4 of the best explorer yachts for sale

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Our resident used boat expert Nick Burnham runs the rule over 4 long-range explorer yachts that would make a great purchase on the secondhand market...

It is hard to deny the attraction of just slipping away from the madness for a day, a week or a month on a boat.

An explorer yacht would be perfect for the job. Here are four to consider making the great escape in…

Nordhavn 43

Built: 2011 Price: £520,000

Nordhavn build incredibly rugged, genuinely go-anywhere vessels that have far more in common with small commercial ships than the typical marina fodder. And what’s great is that this ethos echoes throughout the entire range, from the globe-straddling and spectacular N120 to 43-footers like this one, which remains every inch the ‘little ship’.

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As soon as you step inside the Nordhavn 43, you’re left in no doubt about its intentions. From the sturdy handrails built into the ceiling to the fully equipped galley complete with dishwasher, trash compactor and multiple fridges, this is a boat that’s designed to just keep on going. Incredibly, it’s an impression that only builds as you head forward.

Steps lead up to a proper wheelhouse with a Stidd seat facing an imposing and comprehensive helm station set slightly back from the reverse sheer windscreen. Doors either side lead out onto the decks and a companionway forward drops you down to the lower deck where you’ll find two cabins, both ensuite.

Good-size ensuite master cabin offers plenty of storage below deck

The outside follows the ‘little ship’ ethos completely. There’s a small cockpit aft and a walkway to starboard that leads to steps up to the bridge deck. Head around the front to discover a proper protected Portuguese bridge and if you follow that around to the port side you’ll find a walkway back past the bridge to steps to the boat deck where a crane sits ready to launch the Williams 325 tender. From here you can access the flybridge with its external helm and two more of those Stidd seats.

Performance

Nordhavn boats are all about seakeeping and range, not speed. The Lugger 1066T2 main engine develops a lazy 160hp for a top speed of about 10 knots and cruising at roughly eight knots. The payoff is range – about 3,000 miles from its 4,500 litres, 10 times a typical 43ft planing boat. A Yanmar 3YM30V wing engine provides a ‘get you home’ back-up.

Comfortable galley saloon makes great use of the available space

A strictly displacement hull is designed to simply muscle through whatever you can throw at it.

Specification

Length: 43ft 0in (13.1m) Beam: 14ft 10in (4.5m) Draught: 5ft 3in (1.6m) Displacement: 27 tonnes Fuel capacity: 4,542 litres Engine: Lugger 1066T2 160hp diesel Location: Swanwick Contact: Nordhavn Europe

Built: 2018 Price: $3,395,000

Many boat manufacturers talk the talk, but it’s fair to say that Tony Fleming, founder of Fleming Yacht s, walks the walk. His ethos was to create boats that could go almost anywhere, and then he took one of them and went almost everywhere. The boat he chose was a Fleming 65 called (appropriately) Venturer in which he went as far as Alaska.

Traditional teak greets you as you pass through the saloon doors. It’s a practical layout with a large, well-equipped galley at the head of it so food can simply be passed across rather than carried up stairs. Like the Nordhavn, there’s a proper separate wheelhouse a few steps up ahead, and it contains a great little snug as well as the two big comfortable helm seats. The lower deck includes three cabins. The larger twin guest cabin includes two Pullman berths, taking sleeping to four.

Large galley features top quality domestic appliances

It’s an absolute joy to be able to open a side gate and step straight from pontoon level to deck level. The aft cockpit is left mostly open for freestanding furniture, and wide, well-bulwarked decks on either side lead forward past the wheelhouse to a Portuguese bridge and workmanlike foredeck. The flybridge is a great size and shaded by a fixed hard top.

About half the boat is given over to a spectacular engine room and lazarette, something that really matters if you take your cruising seriously. Twin Cummins QSL 9, 405hp engines should give a top speed of about 13 knots, cruising at 10-11 knots.

Beautifully finished teak is used throughout, including the spacious galley and dinette

“Driving a Fleming is rather like driving a Bentley, whatever the speed it’s a dignified affair,” we reported when we tested a Fleming 65 in 2007. Noise levels were particularly impressive. On that occasion the sea conditions posed little challenge, but a glance at the knife-like forward sections suggest that rough water handling should live up to the boat’s reputation.

Length: 67ft 4in (20.5m) Beam: 18ft 8in (5.7m) Draught: 5ft 0in (1.52m) Displacement: 47 tonnes Fuel capacity: 6,435 litres Engines: Twin Cummins QSL 9 405hp Location: Southampton Contact: Fleming Yachts

Sargo 25 Explorer

Built: 2015 Price: £105,000

The fact that windscreen demisters are standard across the range from the smallest (this 25) upward tells you much about Sargo boats – you’ll find multi-million pound 70-footers that don’t have these.

Built in Finland by a family business started over 50 years ago by Edy Sarin and his wife Lillemor (who is still CEO) and now involving their offspring, all Sargo boats are serious no-nonsense, go-anywhere vessels that are used by police forces and rescue organisations as well as leisure users. The Explorer versions give the boats a little attitude via grey hulls, black rails, grey decks and so forth.

‘Functional’ sums up the interior. It mostly centres around the square-shaped wheelhouse with its hoop of seating aft and twin helm and navigator seats. A sliding roof augments the two sliding side doors. But actually there’s a double berth beneath that aft seat and the lower deck forward houses another double and the heads.

U-shaped sofa hides a hidden double berth accessed via removable teak table

A true walkaround boat , the Sargo 25 is very easy to handle, even single-handed. One step from the helm takes you out of the side door onto well-protected decks that give easy access fore or aft. There’s not much in the way of creature comforts, though – these boats are about practicality rather than acres of sunbeds, but the aft cockpit sports rudimentary seating on three sides.

A range of single-engine options, all Volvo Penta D4 , take you from the base 225hp version through the 260 to a 300hp version at the top end, with near 40-knot reach. But even the 225hp engine, which this boat has, is good for 33 knots. They’re economical too, with slippery, efficient hulls and equally efficient duo prop outdrives.

The forward cabin is one of two doubles on this tough but clever little boat

Category B (offshore) RCD rating is fairly rare in 25ft boats, but this one is rated as such. Sargos are built for going places, and being the baby of the range doesn’t change that.

Length: 25ft 7in (7.8m) Beam: 8ft 6in (2.7m) Draught: 3ft 4in (1.0m) Displacement: 3.2 tonnes Fuel capacity: 300 litres Engine: Volvo Penta D4-225 225hp diesel Location: Plymouth Contact: Marco Marine

Azimut Magellano 43

Built: 2019 Price: £599,000

Azimut describes its Magellano range as hybrid boats, but for once the term doesn’t relate to the power system. In this instance, it refers to a hull designed specifically to run comfortably at low speed, yet still have the ability to reach higher speeds when required. They’ve proven popular, not least with the owner of this particular boat who, after clocking up just 29 hours, has already traded it in for a Magellano 53.

An early adoption of the now ubiquitous galley aft layout leaves plenty of room on the lower deck for a rather intriguing layout. The master cabin is forward and ensuite of course, and there’s a well proportioned guest cabin. But intriguingly, cabin three is a nod to the long-range cruising ethos of this vessel – you can choose for it to be fitted out as a huge storage area. On this particular boat, however, it’s been specified as a sleeping cabin with a single bed.

Lower deck features a spacious and well-appointed forward master cabin

There’s a trawler yacht vibe to the Magellano 43, with wide deeply bulwarked walkaround decks and a radar mast that resembles a funnel rather than the usual goalpost. A dinette alongside the single helm seat on the flybridge makes for a sociable area under way, while the rear section has been left clear for free-standing furniture.

Cummins QSB 6.7 355hp diesel engines give a top speed of about 22 knots. But the point of the boat is to meander at low speed most of the time. Interestingly, when we tested the boat we discovered that the actual range remains exactly the same right down to 12 knots, but then doubles when you drop into displacement speed at 10 knots.

Light, contemporary interior is a welcome change from the usual trawler teakfest

An upright stem and deep forefoot cut through head seas, and fuller forward sections dampen the roll at low speed. The result is a boat that feels natural at 10 knots, rather than like a greyhound waiting to be let off the leash. Much like a proper displacement boat then, but with far greater capacity for speed when it’s needed.

Specifications

Length: 42ft 3in (13.0m) Beam: 14ft 5in (4.4m) Draught: 3ft 11in (1.2m) Displacement: 13.6 tonnes Fuel capacity: 1,680 litres Engines: Twin Cummins QSB6.7 355hp diesel Location: Eastbourne Contact: Bates Wharf

First published in the August 2020 edition of Motor Boat & Yachting.

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Bering yachts vs Nordhavn

In terms of range, the Bering yachts have a slight edge with their larger fuel tanks; however, the Nordhavns often have more guest cabins, giving you more space for family and friends. Regarding quality construction, both brands are highly respected; but Bering comes in at a slightly lower price point. So, what is the best choice for you?

What to know about Bering yachts

What to know about nordhavn boats, key differences between these two types of boats.

Bering yachts are a type of luxury yacht. They are well-made and known for their quality construction.

Bering yachts often come with elegant designs and spacious interiors. They offer many benefits, such as high-end construction materials and ample space to move around.

The brand offers several distinct models that represent its reputation in manufacturing convenient and luxury boats:

They offer seven models of compact super yachts under 24 meters long for comfort and easy maneuvering. Meanwhile, there are four models of large-sized yachts longer than 24 meters.

However, there are also some downsides to consider before buying a Bering yacht.

• For one thing, they can be quite expensive – so you’ll need to make sure you have the budget to cover them.
• Additionally, Bering yachts are often quite heavy, meaning they can be difficult to maneuver in tight spaces.

Overall, Bering yachts are an excellent choice for those who want a high-quality and fully-equipped boat.

Nordhavn yachts are a type of yacht that is specifically designed for long-distance cruising.

They are known for their sturdy construction, fuel efficiency, and comfortable living spaces.

The main benefits of a Nordhavn yacht are its fuel efficiency and comfortable living spaces. The spacious living areas are also perfect for extended cruises, providing plenty of room to relax and enjoy the trip.

A Nordhavn can go up to 3,000 nautical miles on a single tank of fuel, making it an excellent choice for long-distance cruising.

However, there are a few downsides to owning a Nordhavn yacht.

• First, they are quite expensive, starting at around $1 million.
• Second, they require more maintenance than other types of yachts, so be prepared to spend some time and money keeping your Nordhavn in good condition.

Price – Bering yachts are typically a little bit cheaper than Nordhavns. This may be due, in part, to the fact that Bering is a newer company and has not been around as long as Nordhavn.

Range – Bering yachts have a slight edge over Nordhavns regarding range. This is because they have larger fuel tanks, so you can travel further without refueling.

Guest Cabins – Nordhavns often have more guest cabins than Bering yachts, giving you more space for family and friends. This may be an important consideration if you regularly entertain guests on your boat.

Speed – Bering yachts are typically a little bit faster than Nordhavns. So, if you are looking for a boat that can move, then a Bering may be the right choice.

Bering yachts and Nordhavn boats are two of the most popular brands in the world when it comes to motor yachts. Both companies build high-quality boats that are designed for long-term cruising, but there are some key differences between them.

We’ve looked at both brands and broken down the pros and cons of each so that you can decide which one is right for you. Which brand do you think offers the best value for your money?

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Kadey Krogen vs Nordhavn: Which Yacht is Right for You?

Hearing the word yacht brings to our mind luxurious boats with flashy and shiny features. Kadey Krogen and Nordhavn are exactly that with the capability of taking you across seas and can be used as liveaboard vessels. They both are full-displacement vessels. Learn more about the two boats in our Kadey Krogen vs Nordhavn comparison below.

Kadey Krogen and Nordhavn are built with a naval trawler-type design that gives these yachts more robustness and reliability. They are compared with each other because they both offer similar features like offshore boating, liveaboard functionalities, and long-distance boating. You have to make your own choice considering the individual benefits that you’ll get from one or the other.

Which Yacht is more fuel-efficient between Kadey Krogen and Nordhavn?

Both Kadey Korgen and Nordhavn are designed in a very efficient standard with their full displacement hull. These Yachts are small boats with the ability to sail through the deep blue sea. Kadey Krogen Yachts use the John Deere engines and Nordhavn uses Twin Diesel 75-HP BetaMarine 85T engines in its yachts.

Full displacement designs are noted for moving through the water rather than on top of it, making them extremely seaworthy. Their massive fuel and water tanks, large storage space, and large engine rooms in the center of the boat, as well as suitable living accommodations, are all possible thanks to their deep and wide hull formation.

Which Yacht is better: Kadey Krogen or Nordhavn for long-distance traveling and staying at sea?

Nordhavn and Kadey Krogen both have a strong cult-like following among their respective owners. Both yachts are very fuel-efficient and leave a little carbon footprint. Nordhavn boasts highly about their yachts leaving a very small carbon footprint. Many boat enthusiasts highly appreciate Kadey Krogen yachts for their efficient build quality.

Both yachts are made and sold very much for their capability of being small and strong enough to be able to cross the vast seas with ease. They also come with helpful features such as high fuel efficiency and living comfort. Both yachts are equally good at their job but some features are done better than the others for each brand. 

What are the average mileage, maximum oil storage capacity, and oil consumption efficiency of Nordhavn and Kadey Krogen?

Nordhavn yachts are very fuel-efficient and very good at leaving behind a very little carbon footprint. Nordhavn has a maximum speed of nine knots. In actual sea trials, it was 2.19 gallons per hour at the speed of eight knots at 2140 RPM. It is advised to run at six knots consuming 1.6 gallons per hour for around 3383 nautical miles.

Nordhavn has shown data that the yachts are capable of consuming fuel in a very precise manner at astonishing speeds that result in the long-distance blue water journeys that are rarely seen in other boats its size. Also, the full displacement hull allows the yachts to hold large amounts of fuel on their journey.

Even though yachts are inorganic objects, the peculiar bond that exists between a well-built bluewater Kadey Krogen yacht and its experienced owner feels alive and meaningful. The pilothouse will appear to offer its crew safety and security during a long moonless night boating.

High torque and low-rated RPM reduce noise and vibration, which are significant features of John Deere engines for vessels like the Kadey-Krogen. The high-pressure common rail fuel system saves money on gas and reduces pollution. For its size, John Deere’s power-to-weight ratio produces remarkable torque. The overall build and mechanics make the Kadey Krogen yachts very economical.

What features to look out for in Kadey Krogen and Nordhavn Yachts?

Before making your decision you should decide what features are you looking for in your desired yacht. If you want livability in your yacht and quality experience then you should look for those features in both Kadey Krogen and Nordhavn.

If you are looking for the ability to cross the seas around the world these two yachts can do that for you also. Both these yachts are very similar and capable of doing these services. But, you will have to decide the features you consider most. They both provide great deals that will pay off one way or the other.

What is the build quality of the Nordhavn and Kadey Krogen Yachts?

Nordhavn yachts provide full-sized galley appliances without losing beam or internal space. This results in a layout that is both ergonomic and straightforward. The keel of the full displacement hull is loaded with 10% of the empty weight, producing positive stability similar to that of a sailboat that will right itself if sunk at sea. Pounds of molded fiberglass ensure safe boating in luxury, thanks to the substantial construction. The Nordhavn yachts’ attractive interior and exquisite craftsmanship provide both luxury and safety on the sea.

Kadey Krogen yachts assure distribution of hull loads to the bulkheads, stem-to-stern fiberglass girders are tightly spaced, and encased mahogany girder inserts allow equipment to be mounted for maximum strength and reliability. The intrinsic strength of every Kadey-Krogen additionally includes vacuum-bagged foam-cored bulkheads with molded fiberglass hat section stringers, providing a strong and safe journey.

Should you choose Nordhavn or Kadey Krogen?

When it comes to the final decision everything boils down to your in-depth research and your personal preferences. Both Kadey Krogen and Nordhavn build amazing boats that are capable of providing service for the rest of your life. It is a big investment and not a decision that should not be made without prior research and expert opinion. So, we all hope you find the perfect yacht of your choice.

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lurch New Member

I'm brand new to the forum and very impressed with the information and knowledge on YachtForums! I had a Meridian 58 and put it up for sale early this year and it sold. So, my wife and I are looking for a used 55 to 60 ft used boat. We kept our Meridian in Greenport, NY (the North Fork of Long Island) and liked both the North Fork and cruising around New England. In looking at Yachtworld, we're attracted to the Marlow and Fleming. I'm told that the Marlow is a very wet boat and we frequently encounter rough weather. Can it be wetter than a Meridian? Otherwise it seems quite roomy and seaworthy. The Fleming seems small (saw one at the Annapolis Boat Show) and I need a space to sprawl out (I'm 71 and 6'3", so when I'm tired I'd like a salon that I can relax in with a book, and leave room for my wife). The main stateroom is in the bow and I'm wondering if there is wave-slap noise in that stateroom. Any information on these two boats and others is most welcome. Thank you in advance.

Capt J Senior Member

Both are good well built boats, but I feel the Fleming is a touch above the Marlow in quality, I also would not forget to look at Offshore's and Outer Reef's. I haven't run either, so I cannot tell you how they ride, but they both are a major step up in quality above a Meridian.

NYCAP123 Senior Member

Another Eastender. Welcome to YF Lurch. I think you'll find both the ride and quality with any of the boats you or Capt. J mentioned a big step up and more than capable of handling whatever you'll find around here. I met a guy down in Norfolk about a year ago who's had his Marlow up as far as Newfoundland and still likes it. There is a bit more wave-slap with a forward SR and a bouncier ride if there while cruising, but it's seldom a deal breaker. Good luck.

Ohhhh, and with your size. Find a boat with a king size in the master and preferably a full beam master. I have had several owners sell their boats and trade up because they couldn't get a good nights sleep with the wife and a tapered queen master.

PropBet Senior Member

Lurch- Did you look at the 55 or 65 Fleming? There is a night and day difference between the two, simply in what they do with the additional beam, let alone the 10 feet of length. I'd agree with Capt J on the Fleming being a touch nicer, however Marlow is no ugly duckling in the field. I have grown fond of them more in the last year or two, versus several years back where we looked at both of them, side by side, very closely. To each their own. Fleming, in my opinion really, really thought the boat through for cruisers. Husband / Wife combo type sailing. Dig around the hatches, laz, engine room, other systems, etc. and it will be apparent. Marlow does a nice job as well, but I like the Fleming's. There are a couple of fit and finish blunders that Fleming had a couple years back with their door hardware, which I'm pretty sure they've cleaned up in recent models. Marlow had issues in random boats with vibrations in the running gear, but I've not heard much of it in recent years. I think both are well made boats. Like I said, we looked very closely at both in our search. I'd also second opening your search to include Grand Banks, and Offshore. Offshore's are very under rated boats and highly regarded by their owners. There are also a few discussions in the forum on them that have taken place over the years, so it may be worth a search. If you haven't seen the Fleming 65, and it's in your price point, I'd take another look at it. Welcome to the forum!

Kafue Senior Member

Offshore Boats Fully agree with PropBet in regards to the Offshore boats. I spent time on an older 55, then looked over a 62' and finally bought a 58 Offshore for less than the same year 55 Fleming. I and my family found the 58' (which is the same as the 62', just shorter boarding platform) to be the BEST boat we have owned and as PropBet says, they seem to be under rated when compared to Marlow and Fleming. A 55 Fleming is far smaller than a 58 Offshore, even though it is supposed to be only a 3' difference. The Fleming tapers more at the cockpit and has a smaller salon etc. The Offshore 58/62 has a mid-stateroom with a large queen bed & ensuite. Large pilothouse, large cockpit and plenty of storage. They are a low profile for a pilothouse and great layout. We spent time cruising, diving and fishing off the East Coast Australia in various sea conditions and have no complaints. I have been caught in some reasonably bad following seas coming through inlets (we call them bars) and found she was no problem, except I had to turn off the stabilisers sometimes as it felt as though they might tear off the hull. Note: I am cautious mentioning wave heights on this forum because inevitably I will be told “you call that big…..well I had seas this big…etc.” and the guys are probably right, bad seas depends on your experience and is relative to the “norm”. Having said that, the seas over here are not gentle as a rule. Built in Taiwan by one of the better and respected yards. Can be customised etc. Not as "salty" as a Fleming, or refined either, but still quality.

nilo Senior Member

fleming vs marlow i had the chance to look at both fleming 65 in cannes and 2 marlows (around 90-100 feet range) at fort lauderdale. besides the difference in quality another aspect that differs is the general detailing for a better boat. my opinion there has been more efforts, thoughts spent for designing a better boat in the fleming. marlows has a lot of ideas, but seems they are more sporadic and does not so much look like an intact design but more like quick solutions.

bernd1972 Senior Member

I had the opportunity to take a tour through the Flemming 65 some time ago during the Hanseboot in Hamburg and even had the opportunitxy to talk to Mr. Tony flemming personally. Even though I made it clear that I am not a customer for one of his boats he took the time to talk with me for about almost an hour. We spent about 30 minutes of that time sitting conviniently in the engine room and discussing technical details. I had to confess that I really was impressed by the construction quality of that boat, especially the technical details concerning shaft system, electrics, the whole navitronic stuff, interiour quality and sense for details. You know you feel offended when you look at a millionairs´toy and find toy compasses in the wheelhouse. Not here! I inspected the smaller one a few years before at the Düsseldorf Boat show and the 65ft. version feels really like about 40% more ship in terms of interiour space. Concerning the technical stuff, I have to say that I never saw a recreational boat that was so consequently built to commercial quality. I cannot speak for or against Marlow, but I can recommend Flemming without hesitation.

u4ea32 New Member

Climbed all over Marlow and Fleming at FLIBS 4 years ago. Very similar as others mentioned. I've spent a few weeks on Fleming 55 and Fleming 65 cruising islands between Florida and Antigua (warm with both smooth and rough water). Both boats had active stabilizers (Naiad and Trac), but in sufficient seaway as one gets crossing the gulf stream or between the T&C and VI, both stabilizer systems could not always handle the sustained workload to control roll. On both boats, this lead to injuries on board, overheat shutdown of hydraulics, and damage to the fin linkages due to the high loads. Both Flemings are very quiet at anchor due to the lack of chines anywhere near the waterline. This is a very big deal to me, and a reason I won't again own a boat with chine flats or swim platforms near the waterline. Both Flemings as well as all the Marlows and nearly any other builder I've inspected over the past couple of decades have a serious deficiency that would not be difficult to rectify: they need the air conditioning running for decent ventilation. Dorade vents are necessary, but rarely fitted on modern yachts. The deck hatches on the Flemings do give decent ventilation in the forward stateroom, but only if the cabin door is open. The rest of the boat remains uncomfortably stuffy unless its cool and/or the air conditioning is always running. Access to mechanicals on the Fleming 75 is great, but not so good on the smaller boats. IMHO, its at least as important to have standing headroom and lots of elbow room in the mechanical spaces as in the galley, saloon, or bridge. While the floors CAN be lifted, doing so is both difficult and leads to noise and fume leaks. The carbon monoxide danger is very real in boats with insufficient ventilation and unsealed engine rooms beneath accomodation. CO lead to headaches and sea sickness to most aboard. The noise, vibration, harshness is very low on Flemings if you cruise them at efficient displacement speeds. With both Flemings, as well as with most boats, the longer you cruise aboard, the slower you want to go. About 8 knots on the 55, 9 on the 65 seemed appropriate. Therefore, most are very overpowered. Smaller engines would improve everything related to engine room maintenance, and reduce NVH. While the Fleming is very well and accurately documented (this is amazingly rare, and amazingly valuable), it still seemed far too complicated in the way electrical systems were wired as everything went via the bridge. Gives the nice feeling of centralized control, but the reality is wiring become more and more convoluted quickly over the life of the boat. The very good news about both Flemings: almost everything was very easy to access, and nothing seemed difficult to access. Again, this is quite rare and very valuable.

Kapn Member

u4ea32 said: ↑ Both boats had active stabilizers (Naiad and Trac), but in sufficient seaway as one gets crossing the gulf stream or between the T&C and VI, both stabilizer systems could not always handle the sustained workload to control roll. On both boats, this lead to injuries on board, overheat shutdown of hydraulics, and damage to the fin linkages due to the high loads. Both Flemings are very quiet at anchor due to the lack of chines anywhere near the waterline. This is a very big deal to me, and a reason I won't again own a boat with chine flats or swim platforms near the waterline. While the floors CAN be lifted, doing so is both difficult and leads to noise and fume leaks. The carbon monoxide danger is very real in boats with insufficient ventilation and unsealed engine rooms beneath accomodation. The noise, vibration, harshness is very low on Flemings if you cruise them at efficient displacement speeds. With both Flemings, as well as with most boats, the longer you cruise aboard, the slower you want to go. About 8 knots on the 55, 9 on the 65 seemed appropriate. Therefore, most are very overpowered. Smaller engines would improve everything related to engine room maintenance, and reduce NVH. The very good news about both Flemings: almost everything was very easy to access, and nothing seemed difficult to access. Again, this is quite rare and very valuable. Click to expand...

Kapn said: ↑ ... Last time I checked, a proper exhaust system doesn't leak CO into any space on a boat. Click to expand...

Capt Bill11 Senior Member

u4ea32 said: ↑ Right. I think the fumes were coming in because we did not have the interior over-pressure via airconditioning. Click to expand...

vlafrank Senior Member

"over-pressure" He's just talking about maintaining "positive air pressure" in the boat. No biggie. The same necessity exists in large buildings, as well. The A/C does a bit more than just move air around within the boat; positive pressure would indeed inhibit exhaust fumes from coming into the boat, although not stop them completely unless A/C recirculate was selected. Even then, the boat better be darned "tight."

And now for the inevitable............ knee-jerk, rhetorical question, to wit: How come no one's mentioned my personal favorite, Nordhavn? Aren't they even sturdier than Marlows and Flemings? Thicker hulls, stringers, frames, scantlings, extremely robust mechanical systems, and so on? Will no one on this forum even briefly sing their praises as legitimate substitutes for M and F? Hate to be so predictable, but..................

Oh, especially Nordhavns are so different. The smaller ones tend to have a staircase where other yachts have companionways. You either love them or decide that they´re not for you.

vlafrank said: ↑ knee-jerk, rhetorical question, to wit: How come no one's mentioned my personal favorite, Nordhavn? Aren't they even sturdier than Marlows and Flemings? Thicker hulls, stringers, frames, scantlings, extremely robust mechanical systems, and so on? Will no one on this forum even briefly sing their praises as legitimate substitutes for M and F? Hate to be so predictable, but.................. Click to expand...

Marmot Senior Member

vlafrank said: ↑ knee-jerk, rhetorical question, to wit: How come no one's mentioned my personal favorite, Nordhavn? Click to expand...

YachtForums Administrator

vlafrank said: ↑ knee-jerk, rhetorical question, to wit: How come no one's mentioned my personal favorite, Nordhavn? Will no one on this forum even briefly sing their praises as legitimate substitutes for M and F? Click to expand...

Oops! Posted at the same time as Marmot.

What is it they say about "like minds?"

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• Trawler Forum
• General Discussion

Nordhavn vs Fleming vs Kady Krogen

• Thread starter Magneto
• Start date Dec 24, 2019
• Oct 28, 2022

BluewaterN47

Veteran member.

You've done an excellent job of defining what you want to do with the boat you hope to buy or build, a great first step. As someone who owned a passagemaking powerboat for 16 years, cruised her for 40,000+ miles including crossing the Caribbean, the Atlantic and the Mediterranean, and absolutely loved the experience, let me recommend that you spend some time listening to the wisdom of Cliff Rome, who has owned a 70-foot passagemaker and has put more than 200,000 miles in her wake over 30 years. He's an immensely experienced offshore cruiser, and his free YouTube video will add to your perspective in a huge way. It's long but WELL worth the time. Watch it two or three times! Cliff and I have been close friends for more than 25 years. I've cruised in company with him, and he's one of the most capable and knowledgeable owner-skippers I've ever known. Nothing can replace the wisdom he's gained with the cruising he's done, so pay attention to what he has to say. If you go down the path you intend, you won't regret it! Here's the link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTjJtNhSpqY&t As I have said to so many new Nordhavn owners when I welcome them to the Nordhavn Owners Group (which I've moderated for close to a decade), you have great adventures ahead! Milt Baker, former Nordhavn 47 Bluewater  

AGM or LifePro? Dont be in a hurry.... Wait till it is time to change the batteries. The easiest, fastest and least expensive way to go is to remain with AGM. You dont have to change out anything else. All systems are in balance.... Enjoy the season.  

Magneto said: { "lightbox_close": "Close", "lightbox_next": "Next", "lightbox_previous": "Previous", "lightbox_error": "The requested content cannot be loaded. Please try again later.", "lightbox_start_slideshow": "Start slideshow", "lightbox_stop_slideshow": "Stop slideshow", "lightbox_full_screen": "Full screen", "lightbox_thumbnails": "Thumbnails", "lightbox_download": "Download", "lightbox_share": "Share", "lightbox_zoom": "Zoom", "lightbox_new_window": "New window", "lightbox_toggle_sidebar": "Toggle sidebar" } Click to expand...

I’ve lusted over this model for years. Nice purchase!  

• Oct 29, 2022

It would be valuable for the next person just starting their search to see how much you learned and how much changes if you take your time and do your homework. I pulled your wish list from your first post. While you got many of these I suspect there were other key requirements and considerations you added as a result of your quest. Great if you find some time to summarize. For sure IMO the big shift was deciding (maybe under duress of the insurance consideration that you noted) to start with a coastal boat and then move up. No doubt you will continue to add/remove or reorder items on your next list. This from your first post. Congrats again on Moondance! have to have the qualities we want. 1. Stand up engine room 2. King bed located mid ship 3. Giant Fridge 4. Spacious fishing platform and cleaning station 5. Water-tight doors especially to the engine room 6. Protected prop from ice, rocks and logs 7. Redundancy Redundancy Redundancy 8. Water maker  

• Oct 30, 2022

READY said: It would be valuable for the next person just starting their search to see how much you learned and how much changes if you take your time and do your homework. I pulled your wish list from your first post. While you got many of these I suspect there were other key requirements and considerations you added as a result of your quest. Great if you find some time to summarize. For sure IMO the big shift was deciding (maybe under duress of the insurance consideration that you noted) to start with a coastal boat and then move up. No doubt you will continue to add/remove or reorder items on your next list. This from your first post. Congrats again on Moondance! have to have the qualities we want. 1. Stand up engine room 2. King bed located mid ship 3. Giant Fridge 4. Spacious fishing platform and cleaning station 5. Water-tight doors especially to the engine room 6. Protected prop from ice, rocks and logs 7. Redundancy Redundancy Redundancy 8. Water maker Click to expand...

• Nov 1, 2022

Senior Member

A word of caution before diving in. You said you have no experience over 30 of any kind. You may not be insurable. insurance companies do not like large jumps in size. You may need to have a captain on retainer in order to get insurance. One of the sales on the boat i purchased had failed due to the potential byer not being able to get insurance due to lack of experience with larger vessels. My insurance agent ( i went with Chubb) said insurance companies do not like jumps of more than 10 to 15 feet.  

• Nov 2, 2022

twistedtree

Greg QS said: A word of caution before diving in. You said you have no experience over 30 of any kind. You may not be insurable. insurance companies do not like large jumps in size. You may need to have a captain on retainer in order to get insurance. One of the sales on the boat i purchased had failed due to the potential byer not being able to get insurance due to lack of experience with larger vessels. My insurance agent ( i went with Chubb) said insurance companies do not like jumps of more than 10 to 15 feet. Click to expand...

• Nov 3, 2022

Prospective

twistedtree said: I think the worst you will have to do is hire a training captain for a while. I know people who’s first boat ever was a Nordhavn 55 or larger. Click to expand...

Prospective said: Man, that would be some fun stories. Can any of us imagine having a 55 Nordhavn as a first boat? Obviously not impossible since folks have done it. But the learning curve in everything from systems to navigation and boat handling would be steep and long. Click to expand...

Fletcher500

I am currently in DP, the land of the Nordhavn. There is a N55 parked next to me at the moment. The concept of that being ones first boat doesn't make sense to me. Sure, people do it and some learn faster than others, but I am a big proponent of starting off with a smaller size vessel to gain experience and knowledge and then working up from there if the end destination is a large cruising boat in the 50 to 60 ft range. I have been around boats both recreationally and working boats since I was a teenager and learn something new on the water every day and still take my lumps on occasion. Time and experience can not be bought.  

Fletcher500 said: I am currently in DP, the land of the Nordhavn. There is a N55 parked next to me at the moment. The concept of that being ones first boat doesn't make sense to me. Sure, people do it and some learn faster than others, but I am a big proponent of starting off with a smaller size vessel to gain experience and knowledge and then working up from there if the end destination is a large cruising boat in the 50 to 60 ft range. I have been around boats both recreationally and working boats since I was a teenager and learn something new on the water every day and still take my lumps on occasion. Time and experience can not be bought. Click to expand...

twistedtree said: There is a guy who drops in here periodically who bought an N55 and did the Big U (Alaska to Maine vs Panama Canal). He learned fast and mid way was elbows deep in his engine replacing the coolant pump all on his own. I saw his wife at the very beginning and then after the trip. At the beginning she was very WTF are we doing, but going along with her husband’s dream. At the end she was spry and confident and said it was the best thing they ever did. It’s uncommon, but if you have a mind for learning, it can obviously be done. Click to expand...

• Nov 4, 2022

Maybe a 55 is a small boat in his eye. Maybe his friends all have 100 plus footers and he’s just dipping his toes.  

There's also the thought that there's some minimum size (although probably smaller than 55 feet) where you'll be able to learn and get experience that's directly relevant to what you want to do, even if it means you have to pay for a captain for a bit. Starting with a 22 footer isn't necessarily going to get you up to speed as quickly for wanting to cross oceans, for example.  

I think there is an important consideration in all this that we haven't discussed. The guy I know had a pretty specific and bounded goal. He was talking a sabatical, and wanted to go on a grand boat cruise. I don't know if the big-u was the goal, but I do know he wanted to go with his family off on a boat adventure for his sabatical. So he did that, then sold the boat when he was done. In contrast, I think it's more common for people to be seeking some sort of longer term boating style, and I think that's where trying different things and working your way into what finally works for you may take some time. I know it did for us. We didn't go buy a big boat right from the start because I didn't know if that's what we wanted. We wanted to try cruising, first for a few days, then weeks, then months to see if we really liked it. It took a few steps with a few boats along the way, with each boat serving it's goal at the time.  

Everyone is different. I admire people that leap into something like that but it wouldn't be the move I could make. Some of it may also be ignorance is bliss. I know enough about boats to know how complicated the care and captaining of a 55' Nordhavn is. If you haven't spent any time around boats maybe what you don't know is less scarey. My first boat was a twin engine 28' express style boat that my family and I cruised all over. My friends who had boats thought that was too big to start. But for me it was just right. Just enough systems and size to have to learn proper boat handling and care. But small enough I knew I wanted a bigger one. And then a bigger one after that. I remember staying on that boat at a marina on cape cod and being next to a guy who had just bought (a few weeks prior) a gorgeous 53' Little Harbor sailboat. He was single and had just retired. He was so proud of it he gave me a tour. Come to find out he knew nothing about sailing. But he'd hired a captain who was teaching him and he spent his time on the boat crawling around getting to know stuff. No idea what might have happened to him. I hope he realized his dreams.  

If you buy a 'too big' boat, two things may happen. You will 'grow into it.' If you or partner, discover will never be 'comfortable', sell the boat and buy a smaller boat. If you buy a 'too small' boat, two things may happen. You and your wife will learn to economize to the available space or you will sell it and buy a bigger boat so when your kids move out or lose interest, you have extra space, your guest will move in and stay forever. Or in my case, Yen will fill all the extra space more clothes. LOL  

OldDan1943 said: If you buy a 'too big' boat, two things may happen. You will 'grow into it.' If you or partner, discover will never be 'comfortable', sell the boat and buy a smaller boat. If you buy a 'too small' boat, two things may happen. You and your wife will learn to economize to the available space or you will sell it and buy a bigger boat so when your kids move out or lose interest, you have extra space, your guest will move in and stay forever. Or in my case, Yen will fill all the extra space more clothes. LOL Click to expand...

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